The Nursery, a fifth ward.

[Leothiel]

Nyx is an RP guild that has the character of a cult. At the core of this cult is a mysterious and powerful lady who is highly revered. One of the purposes of the guild is to serve her. This is accomplished by putting expectations on the membership base. I am rather ambivalent about this idea. It would be good for new members to "sample" each of the wards, but they will have to commit and start their service to the Lady. Expectations are how things are accomplished.

[Asarelah]

6. Creating another Ward for casual players that don't meet the requirements of the other Wards.n This is my least favorite because it looks like the work it would require wouldn't create enough benefit especially when compared to the other options. From the sounds of the other discussion, this is not a popular option.

nn*continues to shudder at the thought of adding another Ward*nn

I as well like option 2 and option 5, with the exception of calling it auxillery (it should have no name at all and I would loosely call it Ward 5)

nnAn Auxiliary is a holding pool of undesignated and untapped labor that can be allocated for what ever the situation calls for. I hesitate to call this holding pool a Ward at all, for it lends it structure and the prestige of being in a Ward.nnWhy should a casual player strive to participate in some way and be accepted by a Ward if they are already in one, regardless of it's stature ? What is the incentive in that ?nnThe "wardless" should be exactly that. Wardless. Soooo, if you really don't like the word "Auxiliary", label them "Wardless" (more on this to follow). But please, no new "Ward" of any kind for this purpose. It defeats the purpose all together.nnAnd I still strongly object to calling it the "Nursery."nnOne thing that leaps to mind to me is putting a paraplegic in the "Nursery" simply because he can't move and has to be carried. He can still think and talk - therefore is able to participate in some limited way. It would be unthinkable to me to put a tag on him that has negative undertones shaking a finger at his special circumstances.nnIn that tone, labeling them "Wardless" is like labeling them "Leper," or something..... A shunned outcast that no one wants to be any where near..... We might as well show them the door and boot them. I see that as potentially making us Elitist Ward Jerks. And really do NOT want to go there....nnThat is why I thought long and hard for a word that was not exactly as prestigious as being in a real Ward, also allowed that the people holding that social tag could participate somewhere and somehow if desirous and able, yet had no socially negative connotations associated with it. nnFind another word that fits that bill please. *grins wickedly having already tried* As Warzen would say for a Mission Impossible, "Good luck with that!!"nn*giggles, knowing that she is speaking to someone just as meticulous as she and looks forward to a list of "words" forthcoming that will work*nnBottom Line for Me:nWe are laid back, and do not care HOW our folk are able to participate - just that they do something, anything at all. And it is up to each individual what that "something" is, based on what they are willing and able to do.nnAnyone that tries to put a yardstick on something like that within the Tribe is barking up a stump. Me included, "Miss Meticulous Record Keeping Measure Everything Precisely for a Perfect Fit" person that I am.nnI do not advocate kicking non participants that simply sit on the sideline and watch or chat. Some of those conversations are hilarious and some of them add great insights from their view of things.nnThe ones I get fussed about are the "gimme gimme gimme" folks that always have their hand out, and then turn the other way when asked to pitch in.nnAnd I echo Aitana. I am watching this thread like a hawk. Much good has come of it already. Thank you everyone for weighing in !! Thank you everyone for being passionate about being Nyxian !!

[Marlonis]

In that tone, labeling them "Wardless" is like labeling them "Leper," or something..... A shunned outcast that no one wants to be any where near..... We might as well show them the door and boot them. I see that as potentially making us Elitist Ward Jerks. And really do NOT want to go there....

nn

Bottom Line for Me:nWe are laid back, and do not care HOW our folk are able to participate - just that they do something, anything at all. And it is up to each individual what that "something" is, based on what they are willing and able to do.

nnI like these points that Lah has pointed out, and I agree with those members that are feeling, "MAN! I do not want to backpack these other members that are just waiting for a freebie!" It is frustrating, and playing a lot of MMO's and being a lot of huge groups I have seen this discomfort (even the small ones feel the same way). It is hard to say this goes and that stays as you have a lot of different points of view.nnPersonally, I like and dislike a new Ward to those players that are non-functional or too casual, but the issue I see with that is - where does that line start? For example, whom goes in and whom stays out, and how is the regulated? Also, who will control that ward? Aitana, Lah, or other Tall-Hats? It applies more pressure to those that are already doing so much to keep this group running smooth.nnSitting back and thinking about a helpful way to fix this is kind of hard... Man, now I understand better why this is a 6 pager. Every idea you give has an equal reaction of negative.nnI am sorry, but I do not think I can honestly give a valid point of view that would be worth hearing or taking advantage of. Personally, the only thing I can offer is to say whatever outcome will be decided I would make sure you keep true to the ideology of the Nyx - and I am not talking about just the cult perspective as Leo pointed out, though I do agree with Leo as it is the core of the entire guild. Rather, I am worried what Lah pointed out about fear of Nyx becoming an Elitist group of members only. I see this coming as a rarity, since everyone I have ever met within the Nyx have treated me with HUGE respect from the beginning to now. nnSorry I can't offer any really good perspective.

[Grawlix]

I've probably said something similar to this before, but it seems like the right time to say it again. The way to get people to improve or contribute is to create scarcity and then have people compete for the scarce slots.nnFor example, let's say that the Ward of Trials is designated to be available only to raiders who meet a certain set of prerequisites (have certain achievements, attained a certain gear level, etc etc etc). Members of the Ward of Trials get to pay for repairs out of the guild bank and get first shot at raid slots if they sign up for the in advance. We might also require them to have no "no call/no show" marks on their record.nnSuddenly there's an incentive for people to show up and adhere to the standards. There may be slots sometimes for people who aren't ward members, but there are clear advantages to meeting the ward's standards.nnWe could come up with similar standards for other wards as well, War in particular.nnAs it is, guilds are always evolving and always gaining and losing members (except failing guilds, which are just losing members). It seems to me that Nyx is losing people who are engaged and putting a lot of energy into the game. Those are the people we don't want to lose. Figuring out how to stop losing those kinds of people is worth the effort.

[Eione]

Mmm, things for Lore could be such as putting your backstory of the forum and participating in open RP threads. Just continuing Grawlix's train of thought here. Still it is going to annoy some people in order to have to do that but if they arn't participating at all why are they in the guild?nnParticipation is different for everyone, some might view having a chat with guildmates is participation enough most of the time. I fall into that category myself because of my timezone, weekends I'm all over events unless my boy wants to spend quality time which is often.nn*deep breath* Ok less about me. nnI like the atmosphere of Nyx and I just wonder if the apathy is related to the laid back attitude or the fact that Cataclysm is coming out "soon". It happened with BC and Wrath there was a lot of grinding halts happening all over the place. I believe that as a guild we need to focus on discussing what our goals are and then outlining what we need/want to do in order to get there. And I have complete faith that we will get there.nnThis is one giant step in the right direction, keep hashing out those ideas I love to read them

[Asarelah]

I believe that as a guild we need to focus on discussing what our goals are and then outlining what we need/want to do in order to get there. And I have complete faith that we will get there.

nn*smiles very warmly*nnWell said, Eione. Very well said indeed !

[Myyah]

So.. now that we've apparantly exhausted all sides of the argument.... what's next, Oracles? Guild Vote? Oracle Veto ? I am actually enjoying the debates here, even the arguments against my point of view ... it shows me that Nyx is indeed very much alive and populated with passionate peoples.. a sure sign of long term survival.. coming from a survival hunter, I know these things. *winks*

[Asarelah]

I have already implemented much of this in the Hall of Judgment. See another petition today, in the body of a Feral Druid for the Ward of War....nnviewtopic.php?f=3&t=5851&p=36034#p36034nZycanus n Post subject: Zycanus Druid Lvl 80nPostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:04 amnn*smiles at Warby, holding HUGE scissors, and cuts out more red tape*nnAs far as voting, I think all we are quibbling about right now is a Name for the floaters..... Myyah, did you find a word you like better than Auxiliary?? What about Draft??nnA stand alone holding pool of untapped personnel seems to be the popular opinion, with the individual remaining as Ephemeral until such time as adopted by a particular Ward. When adopted, then promotion within that Ward on an individual basis is at the discretion of the Ward Leader.nnThis does bring up another question... Do we "grandfather" everyone presently a member?? Those that are removed from a Ward for what ever cause by the Ward Leader... do they retain their present Rank, or return to Ephemeral??nn*nods to Myyah smiling warmly, and passes hat to Warby and Aitana*

[Marlonis]

I would feel it more appropriate if there was a vote based on guild members. Since, this topic is basing on a lot of different people from the guild, in every ward, it might be important to allow all those that participated (and those to busy) to vote. nn nn.........................................nnAnd SOME OF THIS ! Ummmm... if only I were gree-en! nnP.S.nnDraft is a very neutral and non-aggressive word. I like it.

[Grawlix]

It's worth mentioning, I think, that many, many aspects of guild management are going to change with Cataclysm. There's going to be guild factions, there will be guild rewards, and so forth and so on. I think it's hard to say how these changes will affect our goals and objectives or how we should manage them, so it's probably not worth mucking with things too much with the status quo in mind and more about figuring out how best to strengthen Nyx in a post-Cataclysm world.